Lessons from Goal Getter School: Drema Drudge

Episode 15

Lessons from Goal Getter School: drema drudge

Sue Campbell

The new year is coming and I want you to be well prepared to set goals in a new and more effective way, so I’m bringing you interviews with students from my Goal Getter School for Writers.

In this episode, we look at how one writer met her goals to create and execute a launch plan for her second novel.

Drēma Drudge is the award-winning author of the novels Victorine (March 2020) and Southern-Fried Woolf (January 2023). A graduate of the Naslund-Mann Graduate School of Writing, she and her husband, musician and writer Barry Drudge, have two grown children, a new granddog, and live in a picturesque town in Indiana. They also host the podcast MFA Payday. 

Learn more about Drēma and get a free art fiction short story at: www.dremadrudge.com.

In Goal Getter School, you will set a big goal for your writing career and learn a framework to manage your mind to achieve it.

The goal of the program is to teach you to manage your mind so you can better realize your creative potential for the rest of your life.

If you’re interested in learning more about Goal Getter School and maybe even applying for the January 2023 cohort, visit http://pagesandplatforms.com/goalgetter

transcript

Sue Campbell: Hey writers, you're listening to the Pages & Platforms podcast with me, book marketing and mindset coach Sue Campbell. I'm so happy to bring you a mini season on goal setting, and I want you to be well prepared to set goals in a new and much more effective way. So, I'm bringing you interviews with students from my Goal Getter School for authors. Drema Drudge is the award-winning author of the novel Victorine. She graduated from the Naslund-Mann Graduate School of Writing with an MFA degree. She and her husband, musician and writer Barry Drudge, have two grown children and live in a small town in Indiana. They host the podcast MFA Payday. You can learn more about Drema and get a free story at dremadrudge.com. Now let's hear the interview.

Sue Campbell: Drema Drudge, welcome to the Pages & Platforms podcast.

Drema Drudge: Well, thank you so much for having me, Sue. I'm excited to talk with you today.

Sue: And full disclosure at the start of this episode — Drema works for Pages & Platforms, but she was also a participant in Goal Getter School. So her official title is Pitch Queen. When we have done-for-you service clients, I write the initial master pitch and then Drema takes it from there and customizes each and every pitch that we send out and does all the research and does a beautiful job. Our clients absolutely rave about her. But we did wanna share her experience in Goal Getter School as well, because she absolutely rocked it. We’ll let her share those takeaways. And she, of course, she's also a novelist in her own right. So Drema, why don't you start by telling us a little bit about yourself and what you write.

Drema: Well, thank you, Sue. I'm a literary fiction author. My first novel Victorine  came out March 2020.  Yes, March, 2020. I was already working with you, as in you helping me with marketing at that point already.

Sue: You were a client at that time.

Drema: Yes, yes. And look what happened, and of course I admired you, so I was so happy to continue working with you. So my second novel, I'm actually gonna bring out January 23rd, 2023, so that's pretty easy to remember. And so I'm pretty excited about that.

Sue: Tell us a little bit about that book.

Drema: Sure. It's gonna combine two very different things. I love Virginia Woolf. I say that Virginia Woolf is life. I've learned so much from her, both her writing and her philosophy on life. So I wanted to put her with something very, very different. And so I've combined her and country music.

Sue: That sounds amazing.

Drema: Yeah. Yeah. 

Sue: You and I have talked about all the playful ways that you can do the marketing for that, so that's super exciting. Why did you wanna join Goal Getter School?

Drema: Well, it was just such perfect timing because my book was coming out in January and we were starting, well, gee, what was that? Was that September that we started Goal Getter School, I think? Yes, yes. So that was like perfectly timed. I'm like, yes, let's do this. I'd already had a little bit of a launch plan put together because, you know, I've worked with you before, I know how this goes. I actually had a little more than I thought I did when you and I started talking about sort of fine tuning that. And I just thought, this is the time, let's get started now. I was able to do some time-sensitive things right at the beginning of it. I felt like I was gonna get such a better,  I had a better grasp on the marketing process and like from the get-go, I felt like Goal Getter School was gonna have, you know, you were gonna take a look at it, fine, tune it and tell me, okay, do this first. So I was just like really, really excited to do Goal Getter School.

Sue: Awesome. So explain a little bit about exactly what your goal was. We're very big on concreteness in Goal Getter School. So what was your exact goal?

Drema: So we were going to fine tune the marketing plan for what I'm calling Southern Fried Woolf. That's that second novel. And also start implementing it. For me that was really important because I know your work as a mindset coach is almost equally important to me, if not more some days than your expertise in the marketing field. Because obviously since I've been working with you, I kind of know a little bit about your process and I know what to do. But getting over those little moments of, oh no, nobody's gonna wanna read my book, or are Woolf scholars gonna hate it. And then the country music people are gonna hate it. I didn't know what to do, so mindset really was important to this process, and you had so many wonderful tips and tricks for that.

Sue: Yeah, absolutely. Then that implementation goal, we broke down week by week as well so you had deliverables for yourself each and every week. And in order to do that, you're right, like the mindset, which is why I do what I do, the way I do it, because we won't do it if we don't have the mindset tools to get there.

Drema: Yes. And we actually talked about, first of all, you were kind of like, well, how many pitches do you think you could handle a week? And I was like, oh, I don't know. I don't remember what I started out with. But then I was like, well, five feels good. I can do five. And I've stuck to that in some weeks. I've actually done a little more because once I get in the middle of that, I'm like, oh, this is exciting. Why don't I tell this person and that person, why don't I pitch to them? These markets seem really suitable. They seem like really important markets. So I've been encouraged to do even more than the minimum for sure.

Sue: Awesome. Okay, so tell us how you are tracking. We've got at the time we're recording this, there's about a week left, so why don't you highlight some of your wins and like how you met your goal.

Drema: Yes. So I have a list I'm gonna try to go down here. Yeah. And as I was writing, I kept remembering more things. Okay. So, so far I have three podcast appearances scheduled or coming up. I've received two awesome book reviews, and that was really exciting. And one of those I'm gonna be able to use a blurb from for my book, which is awesome. I did a newsletter swap, which was something new for me, which introduced me to an author that I think is gonna become a friend. She was very willing to share lots of resources and we’re helping one another. I had my favorite writing spot highlighted on Instagram. It felt like just these things were coming in. Like I had talked to this person two years ago, then out of the blue she emails me. I think that's a little bit more of the what was it you said, something like the universe — 

Sue: Ripple effects. Yes.

Drema: Yeah, yeah, exactly. But that was definitely something different there. I have scheduled a blog tour, and so I'm really, that's gonna be a month long and I'm excited about that. Someone I really, really want to blurb my book. I hope she will agree to read my book. So she's currently reading it and she'll let me know if she's going to blurb it or not. But I am so excited about that. 

Sue: That's amazing. 

Drema: And so that's really exciting. I also received another great blurb. I've been asked to be guest editor of a literary journal. It just feels like all of these things are kind of just circling and just coming in altogether at once. And I was asked to blurb a book. I actually just finished doing that, and the person was so gracious and so thankful that I really, really was happy that I was able to do that for her. And it also made me grateful all over again for the people who are willing to read my book and blurb it.

Sue: Yeah, exactly. That reciprocity, you get back what you give out in one form or another. Not always in a like one-to-one ratio, not always from the person you'd expect it to, but if you are doing the work, it all comes back to you. There's a wonderful quote, which I think you were alluding to, I think it was Denise Duffield Thomas in one of her books that I really grasped onto, which is knock on a hundred doors and the universe knocks on a thousand for you.

Drema: That's it. Yes.

Sue: And that's happened with pretty much every member of the club. Things start happening, or every member of Goal Getter School, and also the Happily Ever Author club. When you start doing the work, things start coming out that you never, ever expected.

Drema: Exactly. One thing we really didn't expect. So our daughter had been doing the digital nomad life. She has a cute little Airstream and a cute little dog, but she just last week accepted a position. Are you ready? In Nashville? She is moving back to Nashville.

Sue: Oh, that's amazing.

Drema: And so she wants us to come and visit her next month, which I will gladly do, but that's when my book is coming out too. So I'm going to bring some books, some copies in person, and kind of do some face-to-face marketing as well.

Sue: I think that's brilliant. I love that. Oh my gosh. So tell, talk a little bit about what have been the most helpful aspects for you of the way that we did things in Goal Getter School? These are little pearls everyone can use, whether they come to Goal Getter School or not.

Drema: I don't even know where to start, except I do, and I think you call this something, but I'm sorry, I can't remember the terminology. I call it sort of the when and where.

Sue: It's called an implementation intention. And this comes from, I learned it from James Clear, but it was a thing I think even before him. So you're really carefully designating like, this is exactly what I'm gonna do, this is where I'm gonna do it, and this is the time I'm going to do it at.

Drema: Yeah. And that's been really important to me, especially at first that we had to write down where was a little bit like, really, do I really need to do that? But I found I really did need to do that. So to keep my word to myself one day I found myself in the beauty salon, sitting in the window not thinking, this is Main Street. I'm in the window with my hair and foil, right, in color everywhere. And I am, because you know, it takes like, what, 45 minutes for that stuff to marinate or whatever, I'm like, I'm not gonna waste that. I said I was gonna do my pitching and I'm gonna do my pitching right now. And so I'm typing away. And so like, okay, well the where is important, right?

Sue: Absolutely. That's beautiful. I love that way to keep your commitment to yourself.

Drema: Thank you. Yeah. And another thing on that, when you and I had our first call, we were sort of setting up my first week. I was supposed to get together with someone and I didn't know when. And you said, okay, so you know, basically, so are you gonna call them and find out when or whatever, and be in contact so that you can plan? And I was like, well, I don't know about this. Any time I came up with anything that even sounded like an excuse, you were the excuse buster. I think you'd need a T-shirt. But that was perfect because that also gave me the permission and the strength to say, I'm gonna be here. I said, I was gonna be at the cafe and we would work together. I'm gonna be here at 9:00 am, please join me when you're able to. And I did that, and it worked perfectly. The person wasn't upset, and that was brilliant. Thank you for that.

Sue: Oh, you're so welcome. I didn't even know about that one. That's great. Joy — when I talked to her for the podcast — I was like, well, what have you learned Joy? And she's like, I've learned that I'm a weasel. Right. And when she's not a weasel, she's a beautiful human being. Yes. But all of our brains have that tendency to be sort of weasley and try to, you know, wiggle out of commitments that are important to us if they are a little bit uncomfortable, if they sort of violate that motivational triad of, you know, seeking comfort, avoiding pain, and being efficient. And when you set a big goal like this, you have to counteract your very strong impulse to follow that motivational triad. So it's my job as a coach to look for okay, that's bullshit, that's bullshit, yes you can, yes you can. And of course, I am doing it from this place of absolute love and belief in all of my clients. If I didn't love you all so much and didn't believe in you so much, I would totally let your little weasley brains take over.

Drema: Weasley brain. It's true. It is absolutely a hundred percent true. Yep.

Sue: Anything else in terms of like, helpful aspects that you got from working with goals? 

Drema: It's sort of a set it and forget it. So I would put it on my calendar. And that was really important for me because if someone asked me to do something and it, you know, it was during that window, I'd be like, oh, I'm sorry, I absolutely cannot. And when I started treating it as an important appointment with myself, something that I was absolutely gonna do and that I just couldn't move around because it was there, say I needed to be at work, that's what I would be doing, right? I wouldn't be — yeah. So that was, that was just so important to the process.

Sue: Yay. I love that. I love that so much. What have you learned about goals in general that you didn't know before?

Drema: I've always been a goal person. I've always been someone who wants a goal, and then I'm gonna not only meet that goal, I'm gonna exceed that goal, right? But then again, I'm also someone, once I've reached that goal, it might kind of be like, eh, now I'm done with that. For instance, believe it or not, I've run a few half marathons. And so, leading up to that, I am training and I'm in there and I'm doing it. And then when I'm done, kinda like, eh, I don't think I need to do that again for a while. So I think for me, it was mainly just staying in the flow of goals, being asked about it, being held accountable for it every other week, every week. Have you done that? Are you going to do that? I think that was just really important for me.

Sue: Yeah, and I think that's so important for so many of us. I talked about the Four Tendencies framework before. There's a quiz from Gretchen Rubin that you can take that will tell you one of four types that you are in terms of how you meet expectations. And you and I both love that quiz. Yes. But I find that even people who are not obligers, obligers are like me, really need that outer accountability. But I have heard from my rebel clients, from my questioner clients, which I know you're a questioner, and sometimes even from upholders, upholders are the least likely to need it. But that outer accountability and the check-ins really, really do matter. It has to be like accountability that means something. Not just like, oh, you know, you check in with a friend and like, Hey, check on me and make sure that I did this. You have to have skin in the game and some other tangible ways in order for it to work.

Drema: Yeah. I've got a good example of that. I have a friend and she and I were gonna hold each other accountable not to eat sugar, and we were gonna text each other if we were tempted. So I texted her and I'm like, Ugh, I had a brownie today, what was I thinking? And then she texts back this very loving, oh, we're all human. It's fine. It's okay. It's like, no, that's not what I need from you. Remind me why I don't want to be eating sugar.

Sue: Yes.

Drema: And not that you're not lovely, and not that you're not full of grace and wonderful, you know, you're, you're just wonderful. But I also need you to say that's bullshit sometimes.

Sue: Yes, yes. Exactly. Exactly. That leads me into my next question, which is what have you learned about yourself through this process?

Drema: I have learned that accountability is very important to me. It can be uncomfortable, because I'm very independent minded, you know? As a questioner, I think it's true. You don't like to be questioned, but you question someone to death. Once you understand the why, then you're fine, but you have to get to the why. But then they say questioners do not like to be questioned. However, if someone is questioning me about why I wanna do it in the first place, it's sort of like putting it back on me. And I think that's, yeah, that's really been key for me in this.

Sue: Fantastic. So give us, as we wrap up here, what are the key things that you're gonna take forward with you into future projects?

Drema: Doing five pitches a week is going to stay on my calendar forever. I think. That's gonna be important because I'm gonna be writing forever and I'll have books forever, let's hope. So I'm always gonna want to continue marketing.

Sue: Yeah. And this is for everyone out there listening. There are some people who, some experts who advocate, forget goals and just implement those systems because your system will make it so that when you reach a goal, then you don't like give up and never move forward on it. You know, take it any further than that. Your half marathon example. So now that you've like, you've set a goal, you've reached it, and now you have a system and a habit that you've built, and you can really keep that going on and on, and that's gonna serve you so well. The number one thing that you can do in your marketing is keep pitching, keep doing the outreach, and keep pushing people back to your email list. And now you have felt the fruits of that. So you're very, very motivated to keep going with it. And you know you can do it. And you can do it on the regular even when other things in your life come up.

Drema: Yeah, absolutely.

Sue: Well, Drema, thank you so much. It was absolutely a pleasure to watch you just rock your outreach during this whole Goal Getter School session. Thank you so much for being a part of it, and thanks for being on the podcast.

Drema: Well, thank you so much. It's been life changing. I know people use that too lightly, but I mean it.

Sue: Oh, wonderful. Please tell people where they can hear more about you.

Drema: Sure. You can find me at dremadrudge.com. You can find out more about my writing.

Sue: Fantastic. Thank you so much. Have a great day.

Drema: Thank you. You as well.

Sue: If you're interested in learning more about Goal Getter School for writers, and maybe even applying for the January 2023 cohort, visit pagesandplatforms.com/goalgetter.